Valiant Force Forum

Swap him out and watch him try to crawl back to the tile position, lol! Your lineup is obviously too inflexible to be complaining about guardians being too strong. 

Hello Mr. Enixus!
I'm not complaining about guardians, my team is just fine. I'm saying that Healers don't need to be the way they used to be in the past and Shields (Faye) are way more useful right now, though they didn't nerfed it like they nerfed Healing, both are defensive tactics.

If a healer is being replaced by a guardian of the role she's meant to be performing, that goes to show how underwhelming she is, and how desperate she is in need of a buff.

or they could nerf shield. as I said both are defensive mechanics. It's strange to have only one nerfed.

Hello Mr. Enixus!
I'm not complaining about guardians, my team is just fine. I'm saying that Healers don't need to be the way they used to be in the past and Shields (Faye) are way more useful right now, though they didn't nerfed it like they nerfed Healing, both are defensive tactics.

If a healer is being replaced by a guardian of the role she's meant to be performing, that goes to show how underwhelming she is, and how desperate she is in need of a buff.

or they could nerf shield. as I said both are defensive mechanics. It's strange to have only one nerfed.

Having a healer and a guarding in a team actually reduce the offensive strength of the squad by a lot, the formation is just too passive. In actual play, to use the healer+guardian combo relying on the aura, you need to move the guardian and healer ahead, which will expose the healer to the cleave attack from champion. Any knockback or swap will disrupt the aura combo badly, it is always better to not focus on occupying the tile first as AI tend to move melee unit to tile even if it is a berserker (RIP to every berserker killed be my berserker). Occupying a +3/+4 tile with 2 unit that offer little to no offensive power is just too impractical.

or they could nerf shield. as I said both are defensive mechanics. It's strange to have only one nerfed.

Having a healer and a guarding in a team actually reduce the offensive strength of the squad by a lot, the formation is just too passive. In actual play, to use the healer+guardian combo relying on the aura, you need to move the guardian and healer ahead, which will expose the healer to the cleave attack from champion. Any knockback or swap will disrupt the aura combo badly, it is always better to not focus on occupying the tile first as AI tend to move melee unit to tile even if it is a berserker (RIP to every berserker killed be my berserker). Occupying a +3/+4 tile with 2 unit that offer little to no offensive power is just too impractical.

I know! And dare he say guardians and healers are in need of nerfs, lmao! Clearly a user of of trigger or offensive-based lineups himself to be biased to such a magnitude...

or they could nerf shield. as I said both are defensive mechanics. It's strange to have only one nerfed.

Having a healer and a guarding in a team actually reduce the offensive strength of the squad by a lot, the formation is just too passive. In actual play, to use the healer+guardian combo relying on the aura, you need to move the guardian and healer ahead, which will expose the healer to the cleave attack from champion. Any knockback or swap will disrupt the aura combo badly, it is always better to not focus on occupying the tile first as AI tend to move melee unit to tile even if it is a berserker (RIP to every berserker killed be my berserker). Occupying a +3/+4 tile with 2 unit that offer little to no offensive power is just too impractical.

I know! And dare he say guardians and healers are in need of nerfs, lmao! Clearly a user of of trigger or offensive-based lineups himself to be biased to such a magnitude...

When did I said that? I just said that if they are nerfing the Healing Mechanic, they could also nerf the Shield (Faye) mechanic, as both are defensive tactics. Besides being really strong in CBT they nerfed the healing so that arena battles could be more fast too, as full healing may make battles take more time to end, now Faye is making some battles longer than usual too.
I'm not talking about squads formation or strategy here, you don't know my actual place in arena, so let's keep it that way. 

Having a healer and a guarding in a team actually reduce the offensive strength of the squad by a lot, the formation is just too passive. In actual play, to use the healer+guardian combo relying on the aura, you need to move the guardian and healer ahead, which will expose the healer to the cleave attack from champion. Any knockback or swap will disrupt the aura combo badly, it is always better to not focus on occupying the tile first as AI tend to move melee unit to tile even if it is a berserker (RIP to every berserker killed be my berserker). Occupying a +3/+4 tile with 2 unit that offer little to no offensive power is just too impractical.

I know! And dare he say guardians and healers are in need of nerfs, lmao! Clearly a user of of trigger or offensive-based lineups himself to be biased to such a magnitude...

When did I said that? I just said that if they are nerfing the Healing Mechanic, they could also nerf the Shield (Faye) mechanic, as both are defensive tactics. Besides being really strong in CBT they nerfed the healing so that arena battles could be more fast too, as full healing may make battles take more time to end, now Faye is making some battles longer than usual too.
I'm not talking about squads formation or strategy here, you don't know my actual place in arena, so let's keep it that way. 

No surprise there; I imagine you would want your lineup kept a secret so as to further your agenda of keeping tanks and healers suppressed.


If you didn't already know, the nerf came before the buff to DEF(to do flat damage reduction), which inadvertently brought CRIT and trigger-based lineups to popularity. As such, the concept of unkillable tanks no longer exists like it did back then. Also, larger varieties of lineups (such as ninja's formation-disruption)have been explored since then, further weakening the edge healers seemingly had.

I know! And dare he say guardians and healers are in need of nerfs, lmao! Clearly a user of of trigger or offensive-based lineups himself to be biased to such a magnitude...

When did I said that? I just said that if they are nerfing the Healing Mechanic, they could also nerf the Shield (Faye) mechanic, as both are defensive tactics. Besides being really strong in CBT they nerfed the healing so that arena battles could be more fast too, as full healing may make battles take more time to end, now Faye is making some battles longer than usual too.
I'm not talking about squads formation or strategy here, you don't know my actual place in arena, so let's keep it that way. 

No surprise there; I imagine you would want your lineup kept a secret so as to further your agenda of keeping tanks and healers suppressed.


If you didn't already know, the nerf came before the buff to DEF(to do flat damage reduction), which inadvertently brought CRIT and trigger-based lineups to popularity. As such, the concept of unkillable tanks no longer exists like it did back then. Also, larger varieties of lineups (such as ninja's formation-disruption)have been explored since then, further weakening the edge healers seemingly had.

You know my name? It's Mysterious, so I can't show anything here.
I do get your point, Something that would help would be if devs created a closed APK with some changes regarding nerfs and meta changing in Arena. They could choose some players to test those changes and report back to devs, so we can make mystics great again, their nerf was even worse than Healers.

You know my name? It's Mysterious, so I can't show anything here.
I do get your point, Something that would help would be if devs created a closed APK with some changes regarding nerfs and meta changing in Arena. They could choose some players to test those changes and report back to devs, so we can make mystics great again, their nerf was even worse than Healers.

Awfully convenient eh, claiming neutrality while keeping your lineup unrevealed?


Nothing was changed to mystics; only DEF was buffed to mitigate MAG damage, which indirectly hurt the over-dominant mystics back in the day. DEF itself needs to be reworked(to mitigate by percent instead of flat-reduction) to resolve:
1. Berserker's over-dominace
2. CRIT's interaction with DEF
3. Mystic's splash damage to actually do damage


I get the idea of your suggestion but I worry for the lack of motivation to commit resources for a PTR version so instead, I suggest a online player-vs-player arena mode where players could experiment with any sort of lineup with the ideal faith, LB-ed to level 40 and equipped with equipment of the highest tier. Players are then pit against one another to test the effectiveness of their experimental lineups. To up the stakes for a competitive version of this(where rewards are earned), points are earned for victories and lost for losses but on top of that, a pick/ban phase similar to that used in dota could be introduced. This way, players get to truly experiment for their lineups and define the meta by identifying the strongest heroes without committing their monetary resources beforehand.

You know my name? It's Mysterious, so I can't show anything here.
I do get your point, Something that would help would be if devs created a closed APK with some changes regarding nerfs and meta changing in Arena. They could choose some players to test those changes and report back to devs, so we can make mystics great again, their nerf was even worse than Healers.

Awfully convenient eh, claiming neutrality while keeping your lineup unrevealed?


Nothing was changed to mystics; only DEF was buffed to mitigate MAG damage, which indirectly hurt the over-dominant mystics back in the day. DEF itself needs to be reworked(to mitigate by percent instead of flat-reduction) to resolve:
1. Berserker's over-dominace
2. CRIT's interaction with DEF
3. Mystic's splash damage to actually do damage


I get the idea of your suggestion but I worry for the lack of motivation to commit resources for a PTR version so instead, I suggest a online player-vs-player arena mode where players could experiment with any sort of lineup with the ideal faith, LB-ed to level 40 and equipped with equipment of the highest tier. Players are then pit against one another to test the effectiveness of their experimental lineups. To up the stakes for a competitive version of this(where rewards are earned), points are earned for victories and lost for losses but on top of that, a pick/ban phase similar to that used in dota could be introduced. This way, players get to truly experiment for their lineups and define the meta by identifying the strongest heroes without committing their monetary resources beforehand.

No offense here to Mr.Mysterious Just giving theory. He is probably an experienced player, standing among the top guilds. Based on his knowledge to the game, I'm sure he's been playing for a long time in the game. Maybe P2P but everything is nothing more than a guess. Gaining good reputation, he can choose to reveal himself and become famous. Gaining bad reputation, he can just fade away without harming his true identity. He might be using a second account in this forum too. Seeing how often he post a post (like at least 30 posts a day), he is trying to accomplish something, like become one of the leading figures in the community.

Job balancing is one of the hardest thing to do because you can never accurately predict the result until you release the update to the public. With a small sample size you can hardly accomplish anything in time. Yes, the DEF defenitely need somemore rework. Any unit with weaker ATK will always deal low damage, my 3k attack winry always deal less than 200 with her normal attack, but when she use her skill, the damage can go up to as high as 3k.
One of the best way to fix mystic is probably making their attack deals a portion of magic damage, or purely magic damage. Right now they have low attack damage, low crit, low defense, low HP, skill CD is too long to be utilise nicely, the only thing that kill them alive is the unique skill or those players that patience enough to wait out those long skill CD. Allowing mystic to deal magic damage with their attack would probably giving them some places in the squad-building strategic, as to fight the unit with low MAG (everyone except mystic and healer).

No offense here to Mr.Mysterious Just giving theory. He is probably an experienced player, standing among the top guilds. Based on his knowledge to the game, I'm sure he's been playing for a long time in the game. Maybe P2P but everything is nothing more than a guess. Gaining good reputation, he can choose to reveal himself and become famous. Gaining bad reputation, he can just fade away without harming his true identity. He might be using a second account in this forum too. Seeing how often he post a post (like at least 30 posts a day), he is trying to accomplish something, like become one of the leading figures in the community.

Job balancing is one of the hardest thing to do because you can never accurately predict the result until you release the update to the public. With a small sample size you can hardly accomplish anything in time. Yes, the DEF defenitely need somemore rework. Any unit with weaker ATK will always deal low damage, my 3k attack winry always deal less than 200 with her normal attack, but when she use her skill, the damage can go up to as high as 3k.
One of the best way to fix mystic is probably making their attack deals a portion of magic damage, or purely magic damage. Right now they have low attack damage, low crit, low defense, low HP, skill CD is too long to be utilise nicely, the only thing that kill them alive is the unique skill or those players that patience enough to wait out those long skill CD. Allowing mystic to deal magic damage with their attack would probably giving them some places in the squad-building strategic, as to fight the unit with low MAG (everyone except mystic and healer).

Haha, I was thinking he could be Leonzai, lol!


Dealing pure magic damage for regular auto attacks would make the class a little bit too strong, but a mix of ATK and MATK could work. On top of everything else, DEF needs to be reworked ASAP.


The developers have been incredibly slow on balancing and reworks, but I reckon that they fear backlashes from the community should they introduce a large change too suddenly(which is exactly what they've been doing, lol). That's why I've been looking forward to small, minor buffs and changes in every patch so as to mitigate the potential backlash, while increasing the viability of off-meta heroes and increasing the hero variety in the arena.

You know my name? It's Mysterious, so I can't show anything here.
I do get your point, Something that would help would be if devs created a closed APK with some changes regarding nerfs and meta changing in Arena. They could choose some players to test those changes and report back to devs, so we can make mystics great again, their nerf was even worse than Healers.

Awfully convenient eh, claiming neutrality while keeping your lineup unrevealed?


Nothing was changed to mystics; only DEF was buffed to mitigate MAG damage, which indirectly hurt the over-dominant mystics back in the day. DEF itself needs to be reworked(to mitigate by percent instead of flat-reduction) to resolve:
1. Berserker's over-dominace
2. CRIT's interaction with DEF
3. Mystic's splash damage to actually do damage


I get the idea of your suggestion but I worry for the lack of motivation to commit resources for a PTR version so instead, I suggest a online player-vs-player arena mode where players could experiment with any sort of lineup with the ideal faith, LB-ed to level 40 and equipped with equipment of the highest tier. Players are then pit against one another to test the effectiveness of their experimental lineups. To up the stakes for a competitive version of this(where rewards are earned), points are earned for victories and lost for losses but on top of that, a pick/ban phase similar to that used in dota could be introduced. This way, players get to truly experiment for their lineups and define the meta by identifying the strongest heroes without committing their monetary resources beforehand.

I think you don't really remember what happened with mystics, but let's remind ourselves:

Nerf by Skill Area -> From Full Board to 3x3 Grid
Some Nerf on Aura Skill - Elementalist Kiera used to Buff 35% MAG based on her MAG
Nerf by new DEF mechanics -> Now DEF also Mitigates MAG damage in Arena
Nerf by lowering Skill Damage -> Kiera Elementalist could reach like 200%+ total MAG Based Skill + 2 Turns Burn, they lowered Skill Damage 40% (total) at average
Indirect Nerf by Buffing all Melee heroes by 15% status at average, Mystics, Healers and Rangers didn't get boost.

Now tell me if Mystics didn't get the nerf hammer? You don't see too many mystics on top Arena, maybe you will see some more Ronan now, but he has a mechanic that makes him more useful right now.

About the suggestion, there are some games that do this, mostly when they are more established, those chosen players even tease new content. It's a trend, even more in the era of streamers.

About Real Time Arena, give them time, it is really server stressful to do something like that, they will need a 3x better server for this.