obsothoth
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Re: Retreat-able on Raid Boss

8 years ago

Aiya, that Pat guy is troll bait lai de, I tio trolled once, then cool myself, let us stick back into the main thread than dealing with such people.
Lol ok whatever man. Can't take a healthy debate shouldn't come on the forums man, stick to MSN or whatever lol hahaha

Whoever who disagree with your idea = troll, right I get it lol

And @obsothoth, I wrote all that and you still say I haven't given you a reason? Did you even read? LOL ok, actually I think I'm the one being trolled here and I'm gonna take this @whodahackii advise and stop getting trolled. Have fun lol
Yeah those aren't reasons at all. The 'reasons' you gave were so ridiculous I was doubting you were actually serious and thought you were just ranting.

You said SDD can reach high numbers. If you take away retreat will SDD stop reaching high numbers? No. That's not a reason. There is no reason to assume taking away retreat will contribute anything to build diversity.

HP is the problem, lower HP, problem solved.
 
Pat437
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Joined: 9 years ago

Re: Retreat-able on Raid Boss

8 years ago

Aiya, that Pat guy is troll bait lai de, I tio trolled once, then cool myself, let us stick back into the main thread than dealing with such people.
Lol ok whatever man. Can't take a healthy debate shouldn't come on the forums man, stick to MSN or whatever lol hahaha

Whoever who disagree with your idea = troll, right I get it lol

And @obsothoth, I wrote all that and you still say I haven't given you a reason? Did you even read? LOL ok, actually I think I'm the one being trolled here and I'm gonna take this @whodahackii advise and stop getting trolled. Have fun lol
Yeah those aren't reasons at all. The 'reasons' you gave were so ridiculous I was doubting you were actually serious and thought you were just ranting.

You said SDD can reach high numbers. If you take away retreat will SDD stop reaching high numbers? No. That's not a reason. There is no reason to assume taking away retreat will contribute anything to build diversity.

HP is the problem, lower HP, problem solved.
Omg are you serious? Since when i said that taking away retreat will make SDD stop reaching high numbers?

What i did say was - taking away retreats or limiting the number of retreats per day to a small value will make people choose whether they still want to use SDD or not. Because SDD is very RNG dependent, if retreats are limited or removed and if those who still wish to SDD, got unlucky, they will be stuck with low damage. That is a risk they were willing to take if they continued using SDD with limited retreats. However, if they got lucky, they could still do tons of damage and that's their reward. That's risk vs reward. 

Right now, with unlimited retreats, there is no risk at all when using SDD because people just retreat for unlimited times until they got the high score they wanted.

Just ask @Silventis and anyone who cleared and reached up to at least the 3rd Tree boss especially during phase 2, how many more times more retreats are needed just to get a "perfect" run in the first 3 turns of a key for people who uses SDD. But why do these people (me included) still choose to use SDD? Because, it's still the highest damage potential strat, with NO risk currently, as long as you got time to burn. And the more time people burn, sooner or later, like any candle, we'll all reach that point and ask "What da F*** are we doing!?"

You are suggesting to lower Boss HP across the board without limiting retreats - great, so previously the boss needs 35 people to clear, and after your nerf to the HP without limiting retreats, we can down it with 10 people, screwing the other 25 people in the guild? Great idea.

Honestly, i don't know where you are at in terms of raid wise and i don't want to judge, but get some context man, before debating at least.
 
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gunfrey
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Re: Retreat-able on Raid Boss

8 years ago

hint: Eventually, they want you to stay in their game 24 hours a day so you don't have any time for any other activities or games you can play, so you can only spend on them.

Alternatively, we can all go spend on all the other games out there that doesn't want 24 hours of our attention and not spend on them (VF) at all (by leaving)

Hard choice, right?

LOL
Nah, other games actually forced me to charge my phone while playing all of the content. VF only took like 2 hours a day if i'm lazy, could be a lot more faster.
What kind of game were you playing before? Maybe you can help by telling the devs so they can take a hint.
i dont know why DEV makes us hit the raid 3 times a day....Any ideas? it is just repeating the same things...3 times...
So you can have more chance to try finding the best team composition. But don't misunderstand me though. 
I won't mind if they cut the runs to 2. But 1 run is just too much in case they release a new raid. As they gonna fix the retreat feature.
Lol 2 hours? Hahaha... You're very pro/lucky (or maybe just doesn't bother as much). 2 hours is probably just the amount time I spend on raid if I didn't get f***** by RNG that much or didn't fall asleep doing so. (You know one thing VF is really good at? Hypnotising you to sleep after the umpteenth retreat. I bet Doctors could probably prescribe VF for patients with sleeping disorders after some clinical trials)

And why wouldn't 1 key work? What's the difference? You/we're just doing the same s*** every run anyway
Yes, maybe i'm lucky for having these guys on my guild . My guild members are kinda balanced power wise, we can proceed to the 3rd raid without retreating. 
So we don't spend so much time raiding. The only time this game took longer than usual is during the start of new updates/events. Saying that VF is taking that much time is blowing things out of proportion. 

Oh, before you start assuming something funny about me,  i work in the morning, and i also have class every evening. I can still reach master tier weekly, decent tier during ladder and still got my social life. And FYI i'm not against the idea of reducing the playtime needed, just that VF playtime is not as bad as you implied :)

Read again lol, "in case they release a new raid". Going by the mindset that they may require new strategies or squad. 1 key without retreating is too punishing.
Okay then we wait till someone tell us the best composition. People without the right heroes can at least try to experiment and find the best comp with their current roster. 
You only do the same thing every run if you already got your perfect composition. If you don't you need several times of trial and error.
 
Pat437
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Joined: 9 years ago

Re: Retreat-able on Raid Boss

8 years ago

Read again lol, "in case they release a new raid". Going by the mindset that they may require new strategies or squad. 1 key without retreating is too punishing.
Okay then we wait till someone tell us the best composition. People without the right heroes can at least try to experiment and find the best comp with their current roster. 
You only do the same thing every run if you already got your perfect composition. If you don't you need several times of trial and error.
Yea, i do agree on your point if it is a new raid, think i actually missed that, so instead of removing retreats entirely, retreats could be limited in numbers per day (like i also mentioned almost every time i mention about retreats)

Or maybe just have a trial mode added where you can try how many times you like but the score will never be recorded even if you get a high score you like. That refresh button on the raid entry screen is pretty useless anyway.
Last edited by Pat437 on Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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gunfrey
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Re: Retreat-able on Raid Boss

8 years ago

Read again lol, "in case they release a new raid". Going by the mindset that they may require new strategies or squad. 1 key without retreating is too punishing.
Okay then we wait till someone tell us the best composition. People without the right heroes can at least try to experiment and find the best comp with their current roster.
You only do the same thing every run if you already got your perfect composition. If you don't you need several times of trial and error.
Yea, i do agree on your point if it was a new raid, think i actually missed that, so instead of removing retreats entirely, retreats could be limited in numbers per day (like i also mentioned almost every time i mention about retreats)

Or maybe just have a trial mode added where you can try how many times you like but the score will never be recorded even if you get a high score you like.
Oh yes, trial mode might be good for test run.
But it will make the strategy aspect weak, as people can spam any kinds of comp till they got their perfect comp without any consequences.
With, several runs people will still got the chance in case they fail. But they need to actually think before wasting their 1st run experimenting for the sake of their next run.
Just my opinion as strategy games lover lol

I do like that trial mode idea though  :)
 
obsothoth
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Re: Retreat-able on Raid Boss

8 years ago


Lol ok whatever man. Can't take a healthy debate shouldn't come on the forums man, stick to MSN or whatever lol hahaha

Whoever who disagree with your idea = troll, right I get it lol

And @obsothoth, I wrote all that and you still say I haven't given you a reason? Did you even read? LOL ok, actually I think I'm the one being trolled here and I'm gonna take this @whodahackii advise and stop getting trolled. Have fun lol
Yeah those aren't reasons at all. The 'reasons' you gave were so ridiculous I was doubting you were actually serious and thought you were just ranting.

You said SDD can reach high numbers. If you take away retreat will SDD stop reaching high numbers? No. That's not a reason. There is no reason to assume taking away retreat will contribute anything to build diversity.

HP is the problem, lower HP, problem solved.
Omg are you serious? Since when i said that taking away retreat will make SDD stop reaching high numbers?

What i did say was - taking away retreats or limiting the number of retreats per day to a small value will make people choose whether they still want to use SDD or not. Because SDD is very RNG dependent, if retreats are limited or removed and if those who still wish to SDD, got unlucky, they will be stuck with low damage. That is a risk they were willing to take if they continued using SDD with limited retreats. However, if they got lucky, they could still do tons of damage and that's their reward. That's risk vs reward. 

Right now, with unlimited retreats, there is no risk at all when using SDD because people just retreat for unlimited times until they got the high score they wanted.

Just ask @Silventis and anyone who cleared and reached up to at least the 3rd Tree boss especially during phase 2, how many more times more retreats are needed just to get a "perfect" run in the first 3 turns of a key for people who uses SDD. But why do these people (me included) still choose to use SDD? Because, it's still the highest damage potential strat, with NO risk currently, as long as you got time to burn. And the more time people burn, sooner or later, like any candle, we'll all reach that point and ask "What da F*** are we doing!?"

You are suggesting to lower Boss HP across the board without limiting retreats - great, so previously the boss needs 35 people to clear, and after your nerf to the HP without limiting retreats, we can down it with 10 people, screwing the other 25 people in the guild? Great idea.

Honestly, i don't know where you are at in terms of raid wise and i don't want to judge, but get some context man, before debating at least.
Uh yeah, so are you for or against lowering boss HP or not? You're contradicting yourself everywhere.

You tell me you know SDD will still produce high numbers even if you take away retreat. So its still possible that that even with retreat taken away those 10 people will still dominate the ladder and the other 25 won't have a chance to do anything. Removing retreat will solve nothing. This is a problem with HP or SDD balancing, not retreating.

If SDD can potentially produce numbers that are too high, then we can lower the trigger chance every time the trigger is triggered. There, that's a potential solution to SDD. You propose to solve SDD by taking away retreats in RAID??

For that matter so what if people want to reroll damage? Does VF hold a gun to your head and say you have to reroll too? Because you're unwilling to do it, other people must be banned from doing it to satisfy you? I regularly reroll gold mine runs because I think the energy is worth spending. Are you going to take that away too?

We also already got trial runs. It's called retreating.