Valiant Force Forum

So nothing happens if the guild doesnt take down a boss within the duration? The 1st boss just recovered its health and I guess no rewards were sent?

Yea apparently. They said it on some forum posts. It should be easier to take down now though. XD

Oh, I see. Thanks! I dont have the time to go through all the posts because of work. Doesnt feel like it's rewarding though as we barely ended the first try up to 78% HP only. I guess it's a bad feature if there would be no consolation at the very least to those who did not take it down completely. Lol

Can there be some kind of notification to redeem the reward chest from the raid? 

Dev team will be providing an update tomorrow!

Thanks for the short term fix. This is probably the best thing the devs team can do as other suggested changes will take more time and discussion. I hope long term fix coming up soon.

Pls also read the posts here from many guild leadeds carefully. I hope the devs team learn the lesson to study data of your own game properly before launching or designing any new feature in the future. You have access to all data and you get paid to do the job. Feedbacks from players help improving feature but the devs team cannot rely on players to fix what's missing or what causes impact always. Coz u are the professionals hired to design the game feature. And we are just customers that don't get paid but instead spend money in the game.

This Guild Raid is for P2P Guild player for many F2P Guild Player even can not decrease Boss HP 10%, also that ranking report making another competition for the guild making them feel like enemy must beat.
Conclusion :
1. BOSS HP is incredible HIGH !!! not enough for "normal guild" to kill and get the reward.
2. Reward only got if boss death this one making new raid is lazy to join because its useless, using item but no reward.
3. The Ranking making more jealous and hatred for other guildmate even if they giving advice but still the gap between P2P and F2P more far.

That is my Opinion for this Guild Raid still need more balance.

Suggestion :
1. Make Boss HP more Less enough to kill for the "Normal Guild"
2. Somehow make the reward is claim even if its half because not killed it.
3. If Can erase it for making something for the exchange but still the MVP is get the better one reward.

Dev team will be providing an update tomorrow!

... I hope the devs team learn the lesson to study data of your own game properly before launching or designing any new feature in the future. You have access to all data and you get paid to do the job. Feedbacks from players help improving feature but the devs team cannot rely on players to fix what's missing or what causes impact always. Coz u are the professionals hired to design the game feature. And we are just customers that don't get paid but instead spend money in the game.

I don't really agree with your sentiments. They are the developers of the game yea but they are also humans. Whatever data they can get internally will never be sufficient to preempt all problems or issues that can arise from a greater number and variety of players entering a new feature. That's why they call it a BETA. Dissing them for not doing their job doesn't really cut it here. There are so many possible squad combinations in the game and if you expect them to fully test out all of them and get enough meaningful data to determine whether a boss is too difficult, will probably delay the whole release by weeks/months maybe. 

They do not have the luxury of time unlike PC/console-only games, where developers like Blizzard can hold PTRs/Closed Betas for weeks and months and release the new features only when ready. Like if they hold Closed Betas for new features, people not picked for them will complain of losing out (maybe not immediately but I'm sure people will be pissed if it went on for a few weeks). And the data they get from these Closed Betas will most definitely be skewed by the type of players/guilds they allow into their Closed Beta. A few top guilds may be selected to test and with their leet squads will deem the difficulty adequate/easy during Beta and when they finally release the feature after a few weeks, 90% of the other people in the game will still complain about the difficulty being too difficult. And that's after wasting weeks in Closed Beta. 

You may argue that they can also get non-leet guilds to join the Closed Beta, but would they be as active as those leet guilds in Closed Beta to provide enough meaningful data points for the developers? Those non-leet guilds may have some inactives or new players who may not be able to clear this Raid at all, and how would the developers gauge accurately whether if this non-leet guild (a limited pool in Closed Beta) is not able to clear the raid because it's too tough or the members are not committed enough or the members are simply not ready?

All that above isn't even taking into account the volatility of the mobile games environment, where most of their customers/players may have short attention spans and could change their games like changing their pants.

They are just eager to get the feature out to an anticipating player base to increase the content available to their players and i do not fault them for that.

They have done their part and the patch was not bug-ridden. Bosses/UIs/skills work as intended as well as the claiming of rewards were working - that's what they were majorly responsible for. I am thankful they rolled out a new feature with all those checked (except for some iOS bugs (yay Android) that were also quickly fixed) .

What i feel they could do better though would be how rewards were promised in a feature that's classified as Beta. The rewards system should not have been fixed initially until they decided they are ready to call that feature "Released". Instead, they could have rewarded all players who participated equally for helping them Beta test the new feature until they officially clear it for "release".

All in all, to the developers, i hope you don't pay much attention to those dissing you for not doing your job. They just probably don't understand the intricacies of the mobile environment and developing for them. On a whole, you are doing well generally in your willingness to listen to feedbacks and change accordingly. Please still continue to do so in this great game.

P/S. Please give priority to remove competition in the guild ladder for this new feature (Raid) in your future updates.

Thank you to the dev team for listening to feedback and making quick fixes/changes to make this raid content accessible to more players!

I hope you guys are still planning to allow ALL players who participated in the raid a chance to get the raid token regardless of whether the boss is down or not. At the very least, do it for the 1st boss. From 2nd boss onwards, you can keep it such that "no down no loot".

And please allow Guild leaders/officers to be able to see the members' attacks. We would like to see which members did not use up their attacks daily or even better still, their attack history.

Hello,

Could you please make the rewards from raid boss kills auto-claim or auto sent to mail like Arena's weekly rewards? Last night which is the night before raid boss reset, my guild downed a boss at midnight time and by the time I woke up, I already missed the rewards.

Cheers!

To the dev team:

Regarding the current raid difficulty, I think you don't want a situation where only the most well equipped guilds are able to progress and so gain gear and therefore clearing ability very quickly so that they clear everything while most of the player base are still trying to clear the first boss. IMO you want to avoid the situation where clearing ability over time looks like an exponential curve, which is what I think might happen with the current ladder system. I understand the need to cater to whales, but my argument is if they clear content too quickly they will get bored of the game, and if whales are always a percentage of the player base, having a larger involved player base will lead to more whales.

Have you been gathering data regarding the total damage output by raiding guilds last week? If I am not wrong, the damage values should look something like a bell curve. You can use this data to adjust the boss HP so that a certain percentage of guilds of currently playing are able to clear the boss, assuming their damage output remains roughly the same. For the first boss I would say allow for 95% of all guilds, second boss 75%, third boss 50% and so on.

I guess you will have to release the bosses concurrently to be able to gather enough data for answer all those questions, so I imagine it will take a bit of time. However the actual numbers you implement are not so relevant now. I think the questions you need to ask are; how many guilds do you want to allow to clear the bosses? How are the guilds damage output changing with time? If rewards are tied to clearing ability, how quickly would you like to allow players to progress?

IMO, the increase of clearing ability over time should look like the graph of root x rather than squared x. This is so that whales will always have something more they need to do and normal players won't find their progress too slow. Last week players probably spent many keys and consumables and got completely nothing out of it. I understand satisfaction is tied to difficulty, but that doesn't mean more difficulty is always good, it's a balance.

I saw mentioned before that rewards for partial completion of the boss should be offered. I think this is a good suggestion, but it doesn't go far enough. I think if you spend a raid key you should get something depending on your damage for that session, maybe some consumables you can use or even raid tokens. You can always tweak the token costs to account for this. Like I said, it's all about clearing ability increase over time. The problem is how to manage that curve.

Dev team will be providing an update tomorrow!

... I hope the devs team learn the lesson to study data of your own game properly before launching or designing any new feature in the future. You have access to all data and you get paid to do the job. Feedbacks from players help improving feature but the devs team cannot rely on players to fix what's missing or what causes impact always. Coz u are the professionals hired to design the game feature. And we are just customers that don't get paid but instead spend money in the game.

I don't really agree with your sentiments. They are the developers of the game yea but they are also humans. Whatever data they can get internally will never be sufficient to preempt all problems or issues that can arise from a greater number and variety of players entering a new feature. That's why they call it a BETA. Dissing them for not doing their job doesn't really cut it here. There are so many possible squad combinations in the game and if you expect them to fully test out all of them and get enough meaningful data to determine whether a boss is too difficult, will probably delay the whole release by weeks/months maybe. 

They do not have the luxury of time unlike PC/console-only games, where developers like Blizzard can hold PTRs/Closed Betas for weeks and months and release the new features only when ready. Like if they hold Closed Betas for new features, people not picked for them will complain of losing out (maybe not immediately but I'm sure people will be pissed if it went on for a few weeks). And the data they get from these Closed Betas will most definitely be skewed by the type of players/guilds they allow into their Closed Beta. A few top guilds may be selected to test and with their leet squads will deem the difficulty adequate/easy during Beta and when they finally release the feature after a few weeks, 90% of the other people in the game will still complain about the difficulty being too difficult. And that's after wasting weeks in Closed Beta. 

You may argue that they can also get non-leet guilds to join the Closed Beta, but would they be as active as those leet guilds in Closed Beta to provide enough meaningful data points for the developers? Those non-leet guilds may have some inactives or new players who may not be able to clear this Raid at all, and how would the developers gauge accurately whether if this non-leet guild (a limited pool in Closed Beta) is not able to clear the raid because it's too tough or the members are not committed enough or the members are simply not ready?

All that above isn't even taking into account the volatility of the mobile games environment, where most of their customers/players may have short attention spans and could change their games like changing their pants.

They are just eager to get the feature out to an anticipating player base to increase the content available to their players and i do not fault them for that.

They have done their part and the patch was not bug-ridden. Bosses/UIs/skills work as intended as well as the claiming of rewards were working - that's what they were majorly responsible for. I am thankful they rolled out a new feature with all those checked (except for some iOS bugs (yay Android) that were also quickly fixed) .

What i feel they could do better though would be how rewards were promised in a feature that's classified as Beta. The rewards system should not have been fixed initially until they decided they are ready to call that feature "Released". Instead, they could have rewarded all players who participated equally for helping them Beta test the new feature until they officially clear it for "release".

All in all, to the developers, i hope you don't pay much attention to those dissing you for not doing your job. They just probably don't understand the intricacies of the mobile environment and developing for them. On a whole, you are doing well generally in your willingness to listen to feedbacks and change accordingly. Please still continue to do so in this great game.

P/S. Please give priority to remove competition in the guild ladder for this new feature (Raid) in your future updates.

I'm not sure where you're coming from. If you ever read my posts in this thread. All of them are about big picture impact to players base the way they design the reward system. 

I NEVER make any comment about raid favoring specific team combination. NEVER make any comment on battle system like those that comment on snake minion 1 turn stun is unreasonable or random acid pool. NEVER make any comment that they should allow players to do closed beta before launching any new feature.

I have difficult time understanding how your long post explaining the game industry and how beta works involves my comments. I know it takes time to do something and people are demanding things quick. But I NEVER ever side with any players here that bash the devs for launching new stuff quick. On the contrary, I defend the devs. Regarding beta test, they are doing real-time beta test which I NEVER have problem with.

The devs fail to understand the activity of each guild in their game. That's why i said they should read all comments from guild leaders. Average level of players in each guild and average active members of each guild should be able to be checked by the devs and they don't have to test it to find out. Their flaw reward system causes adverse effect to majority of the guilds with immediate effect. It's not like they are testing the raid game play only while not distributing rewards now. If your guild is the top 3% that are not affected, I'm happy for you.

Not sure if I get your message right, but to me, it looks this way.
My comment is that, before the devs want to do something that will affect players base, they should consider the consequence/impact thoroughly.
But your comment is that mobile game business is fast so they have to compete with time to launch it and they don't have time to care about the consequence/impact. (While you go back to provide feedback on reward system which has always been my point at the end.)

Sorry if my post bothers you. This is the harshest post I've posted on the forum but I feel it's the fact. The devs fail to consider or take into account the consequence/impact that easily be noticed by players. It's within their responsibility. I cannot force you to feel the same but I do feel that I do not deserve your rage somehow.

Judging from what could have happened, I believe that there are guild that start to kick people because they cannot contribute to the damage and render as, useless or waste of time.
This can be a huge setback to those new players that join a good and active guild but cannot be on par with others.
I too is worried about that because I not good with team formation and I usually need people to give me a strag to build a team.
So going towards that area, removing the ranking system in the guild might help and giving rewards without clearing the boss helps also.
But still guild want to see only powerful mates because of the rewards. So it really depend on the leader mindset.