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Yukirin
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My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Mon Sep 05, 2016 6:33 pm

Hi to all Valiant Force Team memebers (GM, Developer, etc),

First and foremost, I would like to congratulate you all for successfully initiating the closed beta of Valiant Force to some selected participants (which include me). I would say I am honored that I am selected to be part of your beta tester.

Before I begin, I hope that the forum moderator would help do me a favour for this thread of mine and clean off any unconstructive comments that may have appear( I read a lot of non sensible remark on one of the "HOT" thread title this game being P2W etc). I wish to keep this thread clean and at the same time have a very constructive feedback from both user and developer. The last thing I need to see someone posted "how much he spend" in previous game, or how balance this game is or why VF team should care more about "Whales" etc etc.

As a start, I would like to introduce a bit about myself. I'm personally a programmer/developer for both web and mobile application as well as handling some role of usage analysis in both web and mobile application AND also quite an avid gamer in all platforms (pc/console/smartphone). So most of my feedback will be concentrating in one goal, "Good game with happy developer and with happy user". Reasoning is simple, Good game will eventually bring in more players, happy players will eventually bring in even more players. Hence, the much more bigger portion of happy player will willingly give money to buy "some practical stuff" in their quest or goal of collecting stuff in game which lead to happy developer who gets paid and have more enthusiasm to bring in more events. IF this is not the goal of Valiant Force Team, feel free to correct me. I welcome it anytime.  

segmented my feedback on Valiant Force into several section:
1) Hero mechanics
2) Item and Storage mechanics
3) Animation mechanics
4) Battle System mechanics
5) Base mechanics
6) Quest Reward mechanics
7) Event mechanics
8) Gacha mechanics
9) Others

[Feedbacks]
1) Hero mechanics
Each hero consist "Faith", "Skill", "Train", "Equip" and "Rune" which customizable to the certain limit that define each player distinctive way on how they define the hero. All in all the idea of it is very nice BUT I would say the execution of delivering is the very problem that make it a major turn off to a lot of players (in my personal opinion). Let me get to it one by one. 

"Faith", this element make a lot of difference in nurturing what kind of hero it will turn out to be.Extra 1 point or less 1 point in any of the stat during leveling up, insignificant it may look but the impact in the end result of the max level hero will be very different when 2 of the same hero with same set of equipment competing in arena (this is just an example). Henceforth, it is not something to be taken as a grain of rice for hardcore players. Rerolling "Faith" is not exactly cheap to be honest but I think the requirement can be improved. Just that I haven't come out with any good idea on how for time being (making too cheap will jeopardize the economy in game as well). 

"Skill", this one is very straight forward, each hero has one skill and possibly one aura (depending on hero). Looks decent setup to me BUT I wish the skill animation could have be more variety between hero instead of just same animation just with different spell name. After all, I enjoy watching beautiful skill casting animation *cough* GrandChaseM *cough* while grinding through stage for item I need. It does make it less boring.

"Train", this section requirement, to me I would say is the major turn off to most players(presumably). Training the hero class to meet the requirement is considerable hard, adding on the big amount of item requirement required just to change class is just pure asking it to be hated due to the limit of the class item farming is very much limited to the class key for the class quest. To some people it may consider a challenge or what's not but in my opinion, if a normal player come to have a taste of the game can get very fast turn off and leave the game. Not to mentioned, your skill will be reset on class change. So overall, this mechanic really need to improve or change for better.

"Equip", this section makes the main spotlight in my attention, SET ITEMS to be honest is a double edge sword for game such as Variant Force. It can either make the hero more unique but at the same time it can destroy the game entirely. I have 2 shoes of opinion, for casual player, sometimes getting complete set is a hassle BUT at the same time it is also known that BONUSES given in complete set item on a hero making a big difference in any aspect of occasion, eventually after giving so much tried in gacha for it. It will burn them out and discourage them from continuing the game due to disappointment of bad draws(I can say I seen a lot of players like these, be it F2P or P2P players); for hardcore player, it can easily become their goal as whoever manage to have the set item complete, it can become a bragging right for them. So in my conclusion whether whether is for the better or for worse, my thought is the later.

"Rune", I don't have much comment of this as I see this as a common to have in this kind of game. I consider this as high level play section necessities. People who reach that level by that time they are pretty much set with all the necessary team of heroes that they are happy with and willing to invest good rune that they farmed or earned to their most favourite heroes in their team.

2) Item and Storage mechanics
For starter, I think starting amount of storage given should be 99 for both item and hero instead of 60. Then the amount of gem require to expend storage increases on each expansion purchased. I think this will be much more better as for one, you need a lot of hero to make like 5 variance of team (if player want to fully utilize the team pre setup option given) and needless to say each hero requires at least 5 to 6 items to be considered fully equipped, so starting 60 slot for items are dead serious bottleneck that I think it should be changed.

3) Animation mechanics
As much as I hate to say but Variant Force character animation is considerably "lacking" for a 3D aspect game. No offense though. It is just my food of thought for you all developer of Valiant Hero. When you create a hero for your game, your hero definitely need to have a bit of  personalities, be it a voice acting, or skill animation, attack animation, class animation, simple chapter cutscene, etc. It means a lot in defining your game. I can only say this, game with personalities does wonders in fanbase and everyone knows what fanbase brings to developer.

4) Battle System mechanics
Variant Force uses "tactic" base battle system, it is neither old or new but is does some fresh welcome with some of the tweak like how well and how much you can "CHAIN" YOUR TRIGGERS.
It change how player decide their team composition and formation in every situation to get the best and most damage out in a single turn. With a good team composition chain, enemy can be easily wipe out in single turn most the time(giving the consideration of equipment as well). Even in arena, the way of execution, It would not be the best way of doing it but it not bad for time being either. So for me is a pass.

5) Base mechanics
It's a very simple base mechanics yet make it fun to watch at. I consider this as extras as it does allow you to get some stuff and do some stuff (farming gold, material, forging,etc). But I would like to suggest that at least make some basic 5 star items forgeable or cratable in the base with some requirement of rare material which needed to be farm from event or what's not in future. I believe VF Team can think of something fun for the event using this idea.

6) Quest Reward mechanics
Quest Reward for gem to be honest is kinda low. In my opinion it does not help when the amount of gem required to draw hero take way too long to collect even after putting some hard effort in completing the quest. Also the means of farming more gem aside from quest rewards is very much limited as well. I will further detail over in Gacha Mechanics section.

7) Event mechanics
Few note to take into consideration for event such as gold and skill potion. I would suggest that either remove the level cap or lower it to much more easier reach level so newcomers can enjoy the benefits early on to keep the good experience fresh. Aside from the Lulu Event controversies, I cannot blame VF Team for accidentally making it a bit way too hard to people to earn Lulu(which only can get up the most 4 star, which in my opinion is laughable) as this is after all a Closed Beta. Important note for making event, you do want everyone at all level to be able to enjoy it and feel rewarded for completing it. Not making it feel like a chore. It only give players bad taste of the game. 

8) Gacha mechanics
Last but not least, the hottest topic...Gacha Mechanics. Sound more like "Gotcha" from trolls that manage to fill the player with the idea P2W HATE bulls. First of all, I would say I love and hate VF Gacha Mechanic at the same time. I love VF Gacha in the sense that It does same / similar mechanic as one of the other game that I still play *cough* 7Knight *cough*. It does have increase rate of getting certain heroes or items during special time/hours/days and the draw still depending on luck or each player. HOWEVER, what I dislike about it is the COST of summon the heroes cost way too much comparative to the amount of gem awarded from quest. This literally screaming for P2W HATE. I would suggest cut down the cost of summon the heroes to the same cost as items or half of the original cost of current heroes summon. Feel reason why I feel this is a need to do for VF Team, 1) Again, you want to give MOST of the player a good experience and fun and feel rewarded to the point even a few bad draws does not make them feel WAY TOO SAD about it as there is a mean to get it again like within a week or so if they know a way to earn it. 2) Players who have some money will definitely consider chipping in some more to get some gem just to draw their favourite hero when it come into the HOT TIME (increase rate i mean) session(me and m guildmates did that all the time), 3) Players with loads of money(which refer to the rude terms "WHALES") will become more eager to be a collector for the entire codex of heroes or items just for the FUN OF IT. So yeah I think this definitely more beneficial to all.

9) Others 
this section is some other etc stuff which I suddenly thought of it when I write these half way through the feedback. 

Few thing i think is an extra plus for all,

1) Close Beta Data wipe : regardless what other may say, in my opinion close beta data needed to be wipe before open for everyone to play throughout the world. Reason being is that VF Team need to show those potential player that the game is a fair game where everyone start fresh and have same chance. For those who participate the closed beta testing, I would suggest to give some form of rewards and those who spend money, reimburse them all back the gems which they purchase throughout the closed beta. For those who whine about getting their closed beta data wipe, go read up what is the meaning of closed beta / beta testing (even though you are not a software developer, a simple google will do you good). 

2) In future, perhaps implement welcome back login bonus for those player who left the game more than 14 days and have to chance of obtain a Variant Hero on the 7th day login(similarly to all other similar game that I play or the game that I still playing :D).

3) Keep the game community lively, clean and hopefully no toxic players :) 

4) Almost forgot to add, the main hero and heroine in the story, I would definitely hope that the VF Developer can make them to be a 5* capable hero rather than just 3 or 4 star at most(same goes for some other 3 star hero in the codex). After all they are the main protagonist in the story from beginning. It will bring player a sense of growth as they progress through the story line. Also, your storyline really could use a good writer and more dialogue. 

So everyone, think in a big picture, don't just think about yourself in game, it is more fun to play with other people. If the game dies, there will be nothing but ghost for you to compete with in the game.
 
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Fateweaver
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Thu Sep 08, 2016 8:11 am

1) Close Beta Data wipe : regardless what other may say, in my opinion close beta data needed to be wipe before open for everyone to play throughout the world. Reason being is that VF Team need to show those potential player that the game is a fair game where everyone start fresh and have same chance. For those who participate the closed beta testing, I would suggest to give some form of rewards and those who spend money, reimburse them all back the gems which they purchase throughout the closed beta. For those who whine about getting their closed beta data wipe, go read up what is the meaning of closed beta / beta testing (even though you are not a software developer, a simple google will do you good).
I  completely agree with this. I agree with most of your feed back but this one especially. I know a lot of competitive people who won't play if the game has an established player base already-especially a game like this. And I know a lot of big spenders/youtube my play spenders that also wouldn't start a game that has an established player base already. Not as many people want to see someone just starting a game when there are people maxed level already, and not many people want to spend thousands of dollars if people have already been playing for so long it doesnt really give them an edge.
4) Almost forgot to add, the main hero and heroine in the story, I would definitely hope that the VF Developer can make them to be a 5* capable hero rather than just 3 or 4 star at most(same goes for some other 3 star hero in the codex). After all they are the main protagonist in the story from beginning. It will bring player a sense of growth as they progress through the story line. Also, your storyline really could use a good writer and more dialogue.
This is the only part I disagree with.  They are starters. If you make them 5* they are no longer starter but mid/end game.
 
EpiKnightz
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Thu Sep 08, 2016 10:13 pm

Hello,

I thought about creating a thread like this, as I also have so much to tell. As I'm also a game developer and wanna be a game designer, I have something to add to your suggestion in my point of view

1) Hero mechanics:
"Faith": Indeed comparing same heroes with different Faith is WAY TOO MUCH different. This come with a major turn off, especially with Mystic class, if you're unable to get Athena faith, your character is sure gonna suck because most other faith MAG grow is weak. It can be 400 stat different with 3* heroes and 700 stat different at 58. That's a lot of Damage/Healing when using skills. And the reroll cost is also too much. It's breaking my heart when I saw my 4* star Mystic class turn out to be Zues faith, almost make me quit my game. How the heck can I find another 5* to reroll? And even if I have, there's no guarantee that I can get Athena faith, unless I spend lots of real money into the game. And like I said above, the stats different is too big of a disadvantage so you surely miss a few players when ever a premium heroes is summoned.
I think at most, the Faith stats different should be no more than 10-15% different between each faith's stat. It make the player feel less bad about getting a wrong faith, and the hardcore player desperate to get the 10% different either way.

"Skill": This is what I think VF need to improve the most. Currently skill of various Heroes seem so similar to each others it's almost bland. I think you will need to at least separate the trademark Heroes skill vs his Class skill into different sections, so the User can easily understand what so unique about a hero better. Just like Crusader Quest, player can instantly recognize a heroes from their trademark skill, whilst the class skill is still very much for user to customize their own build.
And, There must be a more counter-skill/counter-hero in this game. Like, if I'm facing against a monster that can create shield, I'll bring a hero that have shield break skill. Or, a Monster which have awesome health regen, then I'll pick a hero that can counter that. If you play Dota you will know what I mean, i.e AA vs Alchemist, or Axe vs Dazzle. Currently, All Silence skill is extremely OP when vs Lulu in event, there is just no way to counter that, other than having extremely strong 5* squad. And how do you get 5* squad? A lot of Gacha luck. For a tactic game, this is just not acceptable.
And, include it in the inspect option in Combat, as right now, it's only show enemy stats, so it's super hard to prepare for the next enemy skill attack (like I could drink Def up potion before a ATK-based enemy attack, or a MAG up if it's magic attack)

"Train": I think it's fairly acceptable (for now) But one thing I like to add, is that higher level tribute should give much better train result. Like, I have Lv 20 3* which I take so much time to level up, but he's nothing different than level 1 3* mob
Or at least, just like CQ, give a bonus gems for every time you max level a hero. Right now it's completely useless to have a level 20 2* or even 3* heroes in your pocket.

"Rune" and "Equip" seem fine to me, but I would rather have some kind of bonus from incomplete set item (like 3/4, 2/4, it already give bonus stats) rather than having the full set, so I can customize my character better than having the same set on every single hero.

2) Item and Storage mechanics:
I bought the storage expansion pack, and it's already a little bit tight on item storage for me, so it's must have been so horrible for free player.

3) Animation mechanics
I completely agree with Yukirin on this. The game is amazing as it's, but it lack the unique element for the heroes. Except the look, it feel pretty bland between Heroes. Look at Crusader Quest, each heroes feel completely different with their own SBW weapon and their skill, which define them. Though as a Game dev, I understand that it take so much time to anim and create effect for this so many heroes. So I believe that you guys can improve with time goes by.

4) Battle System mechanics
I like to add more combo variation on this. If you play Infinite Combos game you'll see an unique chain system here, with the enemy status. I'm not saying that you do exactly like them, but you can follow some example, like if the nearby Enemy is rooted, 100% chance to burn him. Or you can knock the enemy in the air, and then your team member follow up with a piercing slash. I know, I know, it's hard to implement, but this is just my ideas that maybe you could consider some day.

5) Base mechanics
The idea is awesome, but the implementation is not. There is just so much imbalance to the crafting system. Like, if you want to craft a 3* vest, you'll need the materials which usually can be found at map 19+ heroic. But at map 10-3 Heroic for example, you can already farm the item just by playing it again and again. So what's the point? Why you left the crafting material available so so late in the game when the exact item can be farm earlier? By the time I have enough material to actually craft anything useful, I already got an inventory full of that "anything useful". It's just so broken I have no word for it. And don't make me talk about Iron Quarry and Salvage Yard and Weapon forge, they are completely utterly useless that I never use them even once, due to equipment level restriction. Common, who need to salvage level 2 equipment or forge level 2 weapon at level 40?????

7) Event mechanics
Training event is completely useless if the user don't build training camp in the base. The exp is already easy to get so what's the point for training camp to increase heroes level anyway? I suggest that you change the training event to sth more useful like increase the rate of item dropping, sth like that.

8) Gacha mechanics
Oh wells,
Yeah, you already know it's p2w. And I really understand this. You guys just a small developer team, that coming out of nowhere, and you need money to run the server, pay the bill, give salary to your employee so they can have a good life, etc. You guys are no Gamevil, no EA, no Nexon and there is nothing wrong with harvest initial seed to keep the studio running and keep improving as much and as soon as possible. Maybe I'll fall to the same situation when I open my own studio in the future.

Just a warning though. Prestige system IS and WILL damage you more in the long run. It make the different between the rich and the poor so much that there is not even a single point of playing at all. Just a money race. I heard someone spent 300$ into games like this. For real? Just 20 buck and you can buy some of the greatest game in the industry, with literally infinite amount of playing times with mods and stuffs (I'm talking about Skyrim and Football Manager, dang, they take my youth away)

MMO/Card game/Free to play game should literally cost no more than 30-40$ initially and 10-15$ for each update to WIN. By WIN here I mean the player can experience everything that the game has to offer, before the next update. By making this a pay to win you basically give the Sugar Daddy player ways to burn through the game so fast as long as they have the money, and then when they WIN and you haven't finished your update yet, it will become boring. And if they can spend as much money on your game, they can spend that much money on some other games too. There are so many new Unreal 4 upcoming games that will beat VF easily with the money race. You can't compete with them. AND, the poor player, who just dis-motivate by seeing others complete the game so fast and they just simply can never ever close the gap, also quit the game. And what do you have in return? A dead game.

So for the sake of long-term community, build it up. Slowly. Encourage players to spend wisely to a limit. Don't make this the money throwing race. Give advantage to the whale player for what they bought, but not so much that they can feel challenged enough even by free skilled player.

As you said in Facebook, this game is like chess, with so much tactic on it. Well, black and white in chess are fair and square. 5* full team in a week vs 3* free player? Not even the greatest Batman/Sherlock Holmes/Garry Kasparov brain can compete that. It's utterly nonsense and I think you already know that.

9) Others :
1. Well, I fears there is no chance for CB wipe at all. The rates and everything is almost punishing and people has spend so much money, time and effort into this that there is just no turning back, there is just no compensate reward that can satisfy them. If you, like, easier the rate, giving thousands of gem daily so players can push through and test, then there is a chance that CB can be wipe. But now....
4. Yeah, but I believe dev team is already have plan to increase every hero to 5*. But it will take time and effort and QA testing, so we'll need to be patient :)
5. I just hate the dialog as story telling. Most people are just gonna skip it. Make it simple, make it fun, more image, more action. Consider Dan the Man animation or Porkchop 'n Flatscreen animation series. There is very few dialog in there, most of the conversation is done by abstract image. It's so fun to imagine what they say! But I guess it will not fit VF style.... But at least you can have more action, like cutscene, to represent the world in an visual way instead of reading (or skipping) through the boring dialog. Ofc, this is just my rambling, I know it's very very hard to implement...
6. Also, you definitely NEED to create a Job specialized Gacha, Like my team, which is lacking good healer, have gone through a 2 premium 10x gacha but haven't found a good healer once, or a Champion hero at all, while I get like 6 Guardian. It's just... AAAAHHH. CQ quest have this, and it's good way to build your team to further engage with the game. If it was you, who unluckily draw 20 Guardian, AND all of them has Athena or Hera faith, you'll just simply quit the game, right?

All and all, I love Valiant Force. The game art look absolutely amazing and polished, and the combat system have so much potential, as well as the base building. It bring new twist to the genre. It's like my ideal game, which I would dream to develop. But the core design has some serious flaws that you need to change. Or else... I fear the game would just going down in the long run, which I don't like to see :((

I hope that you will listen to us player, who will ready to help the game grow and develop as long as possible. (I know there is an Online Chinese game that still survive after 15 years with just 1 single player :D)
 
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:13 am

8) Gacha mechanics
Oh wells,
Yeah, you already know it's p2w. And I really understand this. You guys just a small developer team, that coming out of nowhere, and you need money to run the server, pay the bill, give salary to your employee so they can have a good life, etc. You guys are no Gamevil, no EA, no Nexon and there is nothing wrong with harvest initial seed to keep the studio running and keep improving as much and as soon as possible. Maybe I'll fall to the same situation when I open my own studio in the future.

Just a warning though. Prestige system IS and WILL damage you more in the long run. It make the different between the rich and the poor so much that there is not even a single point of playing at all. Just a money race. I heard someone spent 300$ into games like this. For real? Just 20 buck and you can buy some of the greatest game in the industry, with literally infinite amount of playing times with mods and stuffs (I'm talking about Skyrim and Football Manager, dang, they take my youth away)

MMO/Card game/Free to play game should literally cost no more than 30-40$ initially and 10-15$ for each update to WIN. By WIN here I mean the player can experience everything that the game has to offer, before the next update. By making this a pay to win you basically give the Sugar Daddy player ways to burn through the game so fast as long as they have the money, and then when they WIN and you haven't finished your update yet, it will become boring. And if they can spend as much money on your game, they can spend that much money on some other games too. There are so many new Unreal 4 upcoming games that will beat VF easily with the money race. You can't compete with them. AND, the poor player, who just dis-motivate by seeing others complete the game so fast and they just simply can never ever close the gap, also quit the game. And what do you have in return? A dead game.

So for the sake of long-term community, build it up. Slowly. Encourage players to spend wisely to a limit. Don't make this the money throwing race. Give advantage to the whale player for what they bought, but not so much that they can feel challenged enough even by free skilled player.

As you said in Facebook, this game is like chess, with so much tactic on it. Well, black and white in chess are fair and square. 5* full team in a week vs 3* free player? Not even the greatest Batman/Sherlock Holmes/Garry Kasparov brain can compete that. It's utterly nonsense and I think you already know that.

9) Others :
1. Well, I fears there is no chance for CB wipe at all. The rates and everything is almost punishing and people has spend so much money, time and effort into this that there is just no turning back, there is just no compensate reward that can satisfy them. If you, like, easier the rate, giving thousands of gem daily so players can push through and test, then there is a chance that CB can be wipe. But now....
4. Yeah, but I believe dev team is already have plan to increase every hero to 5*. But it will take time and effort and QA testing, so we'll need to be patient :)
5. I just hate the dialog as story telling. Most people are just gonna skip it. Make it simple, make it fun, more image, more action. Consider Dan the Man animation or Porkchop 'n Flatscreen animation series. There is very few dialog in there, most of the conversation is done by abstract image. It's so fun to imagine what they say! But I guess it will not fit VF style.... But at least you can have more action, like cutscene, to represent the world in an visual way instead of reading (or skipping) through the boring dialog. Ofc, this is just my rambling, I know it's very very hard to implement...
6. Also, you definitely NEED to create a Job specialized Gacha, Like my team, which is lacking good healer, have gone through a 2 premium 10x gacha but haven't found a good healer once, or a Champion hero at all, while I get like 6 Guardian. It's just... AAAAHHH. CQ quest have this, and it's good way to build your team to further engage with the game. If it was you, who unluckily draw 20 Guardian, AND all of them has Athena or Hera faith, you'll just simply quit the game, right?

All and all, I love Valiant Force. The game art look absolutely amazing and polished, and the combat system have so much potential, as well as the base building. It bring new twist to the genre. It's like my ideal game, which I would dream to develop. But the core design has some serious flaws that you need to change. Or else... I fear the game would just going down in the long run, which I don't like to see :((

I hope that you will listen to us player, who will ready to help the game grow and develop as long as possible. (I know there is an Online Chinese game that still survive after 15 years with just 1 single player :D)
I kinda agree with u for point 1 -7 curtain things can be improved, i wont dwell on that, alot of people mention all those things. i hope the dev will work it out.

But i definitely disagree with your points in 8.
i think you need to expose yourself to more mobile game before making statement like this, declaring that this game is P2W and thinking that VIP system gonna kill the game. Check out some of the other top grossing VIP system. Its really gated.

What do you get in this VF "prestige" system? The only bonus i see, are the 6* items, probably gonna be gacha-able somewhere, but extreme low rate.
 Other than that, its just things that accelerate your game. I absolutely agree with this guy post here and i like the way he phrase it - Pay for Convenience.
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=59&sid=be44c55762aa ... rt=70#p740
Until now, no one replied to him lol.

if you think $300 dollar on games like this is surprising, lol. You are in for a treat my friend. Mobile games are far far far away from what you think it is.
i used to play seven knight(7k) casually, and i have some friends who are whale on 7k, Brave frontier, and other games. 
By whale i meant, people who spend 300-600 dollar a MONTH, people who wont stop gacha until they get the unit they want, people who just live their life on mobile games like this.

Some even spend much more than my friends. They love it, its their excitement in life! A bonding tool between the whale friends. They are willing to spend and they are the one keeping the game alive for other gamers. In other words, f2p players are just there to keep the whales happy. Whales spending give them free game. Win win situation.
I heard from a friend that 1 or 2 players in the top 10 in VF are F2P players and they just got lucky with the gacha. Not sure how true is this thou lol.
Comparing to 7k arena, at least in VF you can move and cast spell and skills/game understanding are required. 7k arena is like just pure luck and how much $$$ u throw. There is no skills required - Follow this setup, get this ultra rare item, gacha for this ultra rare hero, sure top 500 in the server etc etc.
i hope this post will do some justice & clarification for the dev regarding people thinking that VF is P2W but actually imo, its not. You need skills to WIN and understanding of how different hero work to win in arena. 

Are you a PC/console game developer btw?
 
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Monztamash
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Fri Sep 09, 2016 4:10 am

But i definitely disagree with your points in 8.
i think you need to expose yourself to more mobile game before making statement like this, declaring that this game is P2W and thinking that VIP system gonna kill the game. Check out some of the other top grossing VIP system. Its really gated.
I think you're the one lacking mobage experience.
You cited seven knights, a SEA-based game also known to be a bit cheap on the f2p side.
Play some JP mobile games, and you'll see how lenient and frugal they give out in-game currency.
Those JP devs love all their players. Both F2P and whales.
Valiant Force is doomed from the get-go if they don't change Prestige, increase Gem rewards and make it less "P2W" on some aspects.
 
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Razelle
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:09 am

" I cannot blame VF Team for accidentally making it a bit way too hard to people to earn Lulu(which only can get up the most 4 star, which in my opinion is laughable) as this is after all a Closed Beta."

Btw, I finish all the trial in Lulu event with all of my team only 4 star, and in about 2 weeks after I start the game, just spent 7$ on the cheapest package after 1 week into the game, I do counter some difficulties, but I can overcome it with some tactics :D
I see that almost all this rant and post about VF difficulties is just about people want to be good at games instantly, where the truth is, you just need some knowledge about the game, and some patience,

once you play a bit longer, you'll realize that actually it's not that hard to be good at VF :D
 
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beartroll
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:42 am

But i definitely disagree with your points in 8.
i think you need to expose yourself to more mobile game before making statement like this, declaring that this game is P2W and thinking that VIP system gonna kill the game. Check out some of the other top grossing VIP system. Its really gated.
I think you're the one lacking mobage experience.
You cited seven knights, a SEA-based game also known to be a bit cheap on the f2p side.
Play some JP mobile games, and you'll see how lenient and frugal they give out in-game currency.
Those JP devs love all their players. Both F2P and whales.
Valiant Force is doomed from the get-go if they don't change Prestige, increase Gem rewards and make it less "P2W" on some aspects.
IDK about JP mobile game much, can you give me some example of it to check it out?

I think that if VF give out free gems all the time, Its making the game easier and people can max out content in 1-2 week.
But I dont get about the prestige changes? whats there to change? can you give some suggestion? the only thing i see are those 6 stars item. Other than that, its basically just more freebie that accelerate your game right?

VF content is still relatively lesser than all those established games, you cant have players getting free rolls all the time(by giving more gems) and not paying anything and complete the game in 1 week.
Its ok to be generous, only if your game has been established and new players need those gems to catch up. 7k now give so much 5 stars hero. Even have free 5 star valiant selector. 
You cant compare new games to well established games.
 
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EmpyreanV
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:57 am

I Don't see much difference with prestige levels, I myself have avail some of the Prestige, but still having difficult time in finishing Heroic Stages, I'm stuck at 3rd area heroic stage. LOL
 
EpiKnightz
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:19 am

I work on both PC and mobile games. And there is people who paid thousands of $ in games which I works on. And it also has 10± VIP level too. Doesn't mean that I approve or encourage it.

I know that this is the norm of mobile card game industry. I literally play through every single game of this kind in the market. But I hate that. I understand why they want to do it, but I just hate that. And I hope that VF can make the change, for the better. No one should spend that much in a single games, especially you know, nothing last forever. Any MMO will come to a halt at some point, it just the matter of how long. And I rather that the players spend a few bits with the game every update over the years and have fun, rather than thousands at the start and then keep playing just because you already spend that much and doesn't want that money go to waste.

The reason why I disapprove of "this" Prestige system is that, it has 15 levels of it, and you probably need to spend hundreds of $ to reach the highest level. And the extra privilege is given every day. Imagine in a year how much does a level 15 vip vs free players? AND, the developers encourage it. You need to pay more and more between each level, and the game just suck you into it. And that's is just false psychology trick.

There is nothing wrong with a player spend thousands money voluntarily because it was fun and worth the effort. But it's wrong if the dev "encourage" it, trying to lure them in with the bonus system.

As I said, I understand why they do that, I just wish it's more lenient. 6-8 level, which encourage players to spend up to 60-80$ point mark is fine. But definitely not 100$+ mark.

Update rant: I rolled 20x premium heroes today. And for the love of god still no Valiant (which I guess it's fine, since it's still early) no 5* or new heroes that can upgrade to 5* (which is fine, since they will keep updating heroes that can be improve to 5*, right? ) BUT NOT EVEN A SINGLE GOOD HEALER again, even with Teresa rate up. :(((( I know that I'm ranting, but this is me already paid 20+$ in this game, VIP 3, playing for 2 weeks, which I managed to pull 40x premiums heroes. And I'm frustrated. So you understand how a free player must feel when they get to be unlucky like me right? Or you just not care at all?

As I work for my company which is just merely a branch of a bigger organization, I can't change my game. But you, the devs/designer of VF can. Please...
 
isfuturo
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Re: My Personal Feedback and Suggestion to Valiant Force Team

Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:47 am

There is not much better privilege for the Prestige level at all . . . But of course you can consider the 5s equipment as an advantage against F2P, but does't mean you wouldn't get it in time?
Anyone who willing to pay shouldn't they get something better if not why do I pay? If I prefer to use Shopping mall Free WIFI, can I complain about the speed is slow?
If I willing to pay for a T3 connection, shouldn't I get something faster? But end of the day, we play the same game just that one is faster and another one is slower. 

And for Gacha hero system, this is like lottery system, there are people who are super lucky and some are not. 
Do you always complain why these people won lottery and not you? Do you know how many days and times do they keep buying lottery and you just buy a few times and expecting to hit?

Please understand 1 thing in life, there is no free lunch.
If there is no whale willingly to pay for the game, do you think the dev can survive from the server and marketing cost to get people to play with you?
You should in return thank the whales. VF can make it F2P as much as we want and we will be expecting them closing the server within 6 months.