Valiant Force Forum

i feel like arena right now is quite challenging, it not a bad thing thou.

but i do feel like the hp rune need some nerf..... cause the currently the arena is filled with guardian.... esp 2 fayes.....  which rely highly on hp runes... and i often line up with them T^T

i feel like i can't really deal any critical blow on them anymore... and they just capture the flag with resist rune T^T....sometimes the fayes trigger each others and heal to full hp LUL(rare chance thou).

just my opinion thou~ feel free to discuss///

i feel like arena right now is quite challenging, it not a bad thing thou.

but i do feel like the hp rune need some nerf..... cause the currently the arena is filled with guardian.... esp 2 fayes.....  which rely highly on hp runes... and i often line up with them T^T

i feel like i can't really deal any critical blow on them anymore... and they just capture the flag with resist rune T^T....sometimes the fayes trigger each others and heal to full hp LUL(rare chance thou).

just my opinion thou~ feel free to discuss///

i think faye and hp rune is no problem,there's no much hero who depend on hp except faye and aden (tell me if there's any other) and having great at hp make u have low deff. i have 20k hp faye, but her deff is suck, just 6k, triple hit by szenzerker dragon and voila, she's disappear. even i want they give more hp on hp rune, like +50 for 4* one slot

Okay then, I'm not really here to make a heated argument or anything, so I'd appreciate it if Ralden and Ugh could just tone down on the flaming. If you guys disagree but don't want to argue constructively about it, then you're welcome to simply leave, there's no need to resort to petty insults.

Alright so, as a reply to Airkon, I am not really contradicting myself. I think you might have misunderstood what I was trying to say so I'm going to rephrase it.

So, remember how in mobile games similar to Valiant Force, there are usually two types of arena systems?

The first type of arena system is the ranking based system. In this system, players fight each other for specific positions in rankings, and as such defensive measures (specifically your team's capability to fend off attackers) is important. These ranking based systems tend to rely more on individual power over capability to spam arena resource mainly because you can't really get to a top spot if you can't beat everyone else that's on a higher spot than you. Also, this arena system tends to have an extremely competitive environment and people need to watch their rankings all the time or they'll get sniped, especially in higher rankings where many individuals have similar power levels.

The second type of arena system is what Valiant Force currently adopts, and that's the MMR/point based system. Here, it's pretty much straightforward - defeat your enemies, gain points, be defeated and lose points, and rankings are based on which players have the most points gained. Here, arena resource consumption is important to obtain the best ranks, while focus on individual strength is mostly at a secondary level only because all you need is a team that's enough to defeat your AI opponents.

So the point I was trying to make is that this game encourages difficulty in arena in the second arena system mentioned, when the capability to rise to the best ranks is gated by spamming arena resources, in this case, orbs. 

These two types of arena design are in conflict with each other because the effort doesn't match the reward. If arena is difficult, then there should be appropriate rewards in achieving success over others. Except, here, it's impossible to achieve Champion or Legendary levels without purchasing orbs, and those are really the only levels where the gap in reward is more noticeable as opposed to all levels between Expert 1 and Master 3. It doesn't really matter if you're Master 3 or Expert 1, there's only a 30 gem and 60 blood token gap between them.

So now, we're left with a very punishing arena system that is basically telling you to just autobattle your way through the whole thing, or try to compete relatively well if you're desperate enough to get a couple of more measly gems and blood tokens. And if you're going to tell me I'm forgetting blood tokens, you can still pretty much earn a regular amount of blood tokens by winning at least most of your arena fights, which is really easy at Expert 1 3600 where there are a lot of easier set-ups to handle, at times not even including summoners, and as such autobattling at that range can help you obtain enough wins to gain a decent amount of blood gems so long as you use all of your orbs every time it replenishes.

So now, I'm hoping that the developers make up their mind and focus on what kind of arena system they want to impose. If they want a system where they can earn lots of money (which is currently what it is right now) then they should focus only on changes in the arena system that complements that. I loved the pre-Summoner era and was fine with the pre-nerfed Summoner area precisely because the effort matches the reward, and by that I mean that there is a bit of consistency going on, and if you just play semi-seriously and get a decent amount of wins all the time then you're set. 

Of course, if you guys are having fun with the current arena system as it is now, then don't mind anything I say, it's mostly just an opinion anyway and it's currently how I view it. It's still a major feature within the game though and I'm hoping they can do something to make it better in the future, where it's something that you can get relatively serious at and be rewarded more appropriately based on your efforts.

The first type of arena system is the ranking based system. In this system, players fight each other for specific positions in rankings, and as such defensive measures (specifically your team's capability to fend off attackers) is important. These ranking based systems tend to rely more on individual power over capability to spam arena resource mainly because you can't really get to a top spot if you can't beat everyone else that's on a higher spot than you. Also, this arena system tends to have an extremely competitive environment and people need to watch their rankings all the time or they'll get sniped, especially in higher rankings where many individuals have similar power levels.

I know the Developer just loves a good game to compare or to do research on, so I'm just gonna say; DragonBlaze's Fortress Battle.

i feel like arena right now is quite challenging, it not a bad thing thou.

but i do feel like the hp rune need some nerf..... cause the currently the arena is filled with guardian.... esp 2 fayes.....  which rely highly on hp runes... and i often line up with them T^T

i feel like i can't really deal any critical blow on them anymore... and they just capture the flag with resist rune T^T....sometimes the fayes trigger each others and heal to full hp LUL(rare chance thou).

just my opinion thou~ feel free to discuss///

i think faye and hp rune is no problem,there's no much hero who depend on hp except faye and aden (tell me if there's any other) and having great at hp make u have low deff. i have 20k hp faye, but her deff is suck, just 6k, triple hit by szenzerker dragon and voila, she's disappear. even i want they give more hp on hp rune, like +50 for 4* one slot

Hmm...not quite, cause with nice eq and runes, faye can go easily up to 20k hp and 10k def. that makes her super tanky, and thats why tank meta exist, u rarely see ronan one shot anyone so back to my point, nerf hp rune a little

Okay then, I'm not really here to make a heated argument or anything, so I'd appreciate it if Ralden and Ugh could just tone down on the flaming. If you guys disagree but don't want to argue constructively about it, then you're welcome to simply leave, there's no need to resort to petty insults.

Alright so, as a reply to Airkon, I am not really contradicting myself. I think you might have misunderstood what I was trying to say so I'm going to rephrase it.

So, remember how in mobile games similar to Valiant Force, there are usually two types of arena systems?

The first type of arena system is the ranking based system. In this system, players fight each other for specific positions in rankings, and as such defensive measures (specifically your team's capability to fend off attackers) is important. These ranking based systems tend to rely more on individual power over capability to spam arena resource mainly because you can't really get to a top spot if you can't beat everyone else that's on a higher spot than you. Also, this arena system tends to have an extremely competitive environment and people need to watch their rankings all the time or they'll get sniped, especially in higher rankings where many individuals have similar power levels.

The second type of arena system is what Valiant Force currently adopts, and that's the MMR/point based system. Here, it's pretty much straightforward - defeat your enemies, gain points, be defeated and lose points, and rankings are based on which players have the most points gained. Here, arena resource consumption is important to obtain the best ranks, while focus on individual strength is mostly at a secondary level only because all you need is a team that's enough to defeat your AI opponents.

So the point I was trying to make is that this game encourages difficulty in arena in the second arena system mentioned, when the capability to rise to the best ranks is gated by spamming arena resources, in this case, orbs. 

These two types of arena design are in conflict with each other because the effort doesn't match the reward. If arena is difficult, then there should be appropriate rewards in achieving success over others. Except, here, it's impossible to achieve Champion or Legendary levels without purchasing orbs, and those are really the only levels where the gap in reward is more noticeable as opposed to all levels between Expert 1 and Master 3. It doesn't really matter if you're Master 3 or Expert 1, there's only a 30 gem and 60 blood token gap between them.

So now, we're left with a very punishing arena system that is basically telling you to just autobattle your way through the whole thing, or try to compete relatively well if you're desperate enough to get a couple of more measly gems and blood tokens. And if you're going to tell me I'm forgetting blood tokens, you can still pretty much earn a regular amount of blood tokens by winning at least most of your arena fights, which is really easy at Expert 1 3600 where there are a lot of easier set-ups to handle, at times not even including summoners, and as such autobattling at that range can help you obtain enough wins to gain a decent amount of blood gems so long as you use all of your orbs every time it replenishes.

So now, I'm hoping that the developers make up their mind and focus on what kind of arena system they want to impose. If they want a system where they can earn lots of money (which is currently what it is right now) then they should focus only on changes in the arena system that complements that. I loved the pre-Summoner era and was fine with the pre-nerfed Summoner area precisely because the effort matches the reward, and by that I mean that there is a bit of consistency going on, and if you just play semi-seriously and get a decent amount of wins all the time then you're set. 

Of course, if you guys are having fun with the current arena system as it is now, then don't mind anything I say, it's mostly just an opinion anyway and it's currently how I view it. It's still a major feature within the game though and I'm hoping they can do something to make it better in the future, where it's something that you can get relatively serious at and be rewarded more appropriately based on your efforts.

i kinda get your point but i think you're being close minded about the type of arena we have right now because you only view it as the money making type of arena.
you forgot that when we fight in the arena we gain points not 1 win as a score.... that makes a lot of difference.
im not gonna explain much about this  because 1. im lazy and 2 i think we already know what kind of arena you really want and thats called a "ladder" spamming mindlessly to gain more points
you are really missing the point of the arena and its to fight other players teams having a mediocre team wont get you anywhere,

and with your previous comment about "anyone can climb in the arena by spamming orbs" i think thats a bit selfish and its kind of an insult for the people at the top
yes its given that they spend money to buy orbs but do you think if they use your team
 would they have the same result?
the arena right now gives space for some f2p or dolphins to have a chance to climb a bit high if they spend there resources correctly and make a good and well equipped team.
try to be open minded about the arena its not what you think it is..

I just wanna stop by this thread and say I'm using Luthor in Arena. LOL

I just wanna stop by this thread and say I'm using Luthor in Arena. LOL

You have my respect! 

I just wanna stop by this thread and say I'm using Luthor in Arena. LOL

ggwp

My respect for you knows no bounds