Valiant Force Forum

As much as I hate trigger teams, implementing a stamina quota immediately kills rangers/healers triggers imo. Both classes can't take a hit, even more so with the rangers as healers have a bit of MAG even when fully invested in ATK(meaning they can take skill damage somewhat better). The strategy behind trigger teams is kill everything before the enemy reacts and they absolutely have 0 defenses to speak of. I think reducing the chances of triggering when a trigger occurs is already the most feasible solution. 

And no, I don't use trigger team in PvP in case you think I'm a user of a cheap(but highly efficient) strategy. 

On a similar note, I'd much prefer your suggestion over diminishing trigger chances if Mystics and healers have something relevant to do while their skill is on CD. It would really be nice if mystics and healers have some sort of subskill they can use (like inflicting freeze on one target, removing debuff, add ATK to an ally, etc.). This way, all heroes except guardians(they function as tanks though so they aren't really supposed to be doing the damage under normal circumstances) can contribute something every turn. It would be cool if summoner Talissa can summon two small golems every turn(I can see them having half the stats of her golem). On the other hand, maybe AB Lucille could give an immunity to one ally every turn. This essentially gives healers and mystics a niche in PvE. I don't think that's enough to outclass trigger teams but I think they'd now be highly viable for PvE content.

The stratgy ain’t cheap, it cost 3k USD to make one fully functional team performing at max capability in order to compete. If they nerf it out of contention, alot of us have to quit.

As much as I hate trigger teams, implementing a stamina quota immediately kills rangers/healers triggers imo. Both classes can't take a hit, even more so with the rangers as healers have a bit of MAG even when fully invested in ATK(meaning they can take skill damage somewhat better). The strategy behind trigger teams is kill everything before the enemy reacts and they absolutely have 0 defenses to speak of. I think reducing the chances of triggering when a trigger occurs is already the most feasible solution. 

And no, I don't use trigger team in PvP in case you think I'm a user of a cheap(but highly efficient) strategy. 

On a similar note, I'd much prefer your suggestion over diminishing trigger chances if Mystics and healers have something relevant to do while their skill is on CD. It would really be nice if mystics and healers have some sort of subskill they can use (like inflicting freeze on one target, removing debuff, add ATK to an ally, etc.). This way, all heroes except guardians(they function as tanks though so they aren't really supposed to be doing the damage under normal circumstances) can contribute something every turn. It would be cool if summoner Talissa can summon two small golems every turn(I can see them having half the stats of her golem). On the other hand, maybe AB Lucille could give an immunity to one ally every turn. This essentially gives healers and mystics a niche in PvE. I don't think that's enough to outclass trigger teams but I think they'd now be highly viable for PvE content.

The stratgy ain’t cheap, it cost 3k USD to make one fully functional team performing at max capability in order to compete. If they nerf it out of contention, alot of us have to quit.

Uhh, I meant cheap strategy, not cheap cost in forming the team. Anyway, it's my opinion so it's not my problem if in case you get offended by it.

On a side note, that is unfortunate if you paid that much money just for this game. 

As much as I hate trigger teams, implementing a stamina quota immediately kills rangers/healers triggers imo. Both classes can't take a hit, even more so with the rangers as healers have a bit of MAG even when fully invested in ATK(meaning they can take skill damage somewhat better). The strategy behind trigger teams is kill everything before the enemy reacts and they absolutely have 0 defenses to speak of. I think reducing the chances of triggering when a trigger occurs is already the most feasible solution. 

And no, I don't use trigger team in PvP in case you think I'm a user of a cheap(but highly efficient) strategy. 

On a similar note, I'd much prefer your suggestion over diminishing trigger chances if Mystics and healers have something relevant to do while their skill is on CD. It would really be nice if mystics and healers have some sort of subskill they can use (like inflicting freeze on one target, removing debuff, add ATK to an ally, etc.). This way, all heroes except guardians(they function as tanks though so they aren't really supposed to be doing the damage under normal circumstances) can contribute something every turn. It would be cool if summoner Talissa can summon two small golems every turn(I can see them having half the stats of her golem). On the other hand, maybe AB Lucille could give an immunity to one ally every turn. This essentially gives healers and mystics a niche in PvE. I don't think that's enough to outclass trigger teams but I think they'd now be highly viable for PvE content.

The stratgy ain’t cheap, it cost 3k USD to make one fully functional team performing at max capability in order to compete. If they nerf it out of contention, alot of us have to quit.

Uhh, I meant cheap strategy, not cheap cost in forming the team. 

If it cost alot to make, i doubt its a cheap easy strategy, the thinking going into how to further reducing my reliant on rng triggers is quite tedious. And in order to test that i just have to top up another 300 USD etc. to make it. And of course I’m a user of that strategy, basically compiled all experience archer squad users usage and came out with the best one, healer squad utilises the same format as well. Triggering is one of the many mechanics available to us, have you explored using dodge, counterattack and stealth to counter react to this strategy? Why not you put in USD $500 to make that team and show us how do you counter them?

Theorycrafting is cheap and amounts to mental masturbation, it lets us feel great about ourselves. But realising the theorycrafted team needs time and of course money, we’re playing a game published by a business not a non-profit organisation.

I await your team countering mine in the foreseeable weeks to come!

Your friendly neighbourhood wanker,

Speed.Wanker
Arathos

The stratgy ain’t cheap, it cost 3k USD to make one fully functional team performing at max capability in order to compete. If they nerf it out of contention, alot of us have to quit.

Uhh, I meant cheap strategy, not cheap cost in forming the team. 

If it cost alot to make, i doubt its a cheap easy strategy, the thinking going into how to further reducing my reliant on rng triggers is quite tedious. And in order to test that i just have to top up another 300 USD etc. to make it. And of course I’m a user of that strategy, basically compiled all experience archer squad users usage and came out with the best one, healer squad utilises the same format as well. Triggering is one of the many mechanics available to us, have you explored using dodge, counterattack and stealth to counter react to this strategy? Why not you put in USD $500 to make that team and show us how do you counter them?

Theorycrafting is cheap and amounts to mental masturbation, it lets us feel great about ourselves. But realising the theorycrafted team needs time and of course money, we’re playing a game published by a business not a non-profit organisation.

I await your team countering mine in the foreseeable weeks to come!

Your friendly neighbourhood wanker,

Speed.Wanker
Arathos

I called it cheap strategy because it's too reliable and consistent in what it does versus the game's general content and a good trigger team relieves the player of extensive strategy making. A fully built ranger trigger team is effective in almost all parts of the game. Even against raid 2, I think ranger squads can do a good chunk of damage even if there are counter auras from the bosses. I personally think it's kind of lame(there I changed it) that trigger teams are the easy route to this game and I think there are no other reliable ways so far to handle the game as efficiently. I'm personally pissed that this squad is so efficient and continues to get improved by the devs until this point(adding RRH for more skill damage but planning on nerfing the trigger squad consequently) while other classes and heroes, especially mystics are mostly bad except for PvP. 

Anyway, everything I was saying was personal insights. I'm not claiming I'm right but I think trigger squads are too efficient with what they do in the game. PvP, PvE, raid, ladder events lost map, they can do everything incredibly well as compared to other squad compositions. Without  a trigger team, I can't imagine getting far in the game, honestly. All in all, it's more of a personal frustration that why are some classes given impressive tools to utilize while other classes are almost useless?  

As I post this comment, i think nerfing trigger teams should only happen when more possible strategies can be utilized in handling the raid bosses. I think nerfing them is  well-deserved considering their general efficiency but what other strategy would work against the upcoming retconning of raid 2?

Uhh, I meant cheap strategy, not cheap cost in forming the team. 

If it cost alot to make, i doubt its a cheap easy strategy, the thinking going into how to further reducing my reliant on rng triggers is quite tedious. And in order to test that i just have to top up another 300 USD etc. to make it. And of course I’m a user of that strategy, basically compiled all experience archer squad users usage and came out with the best one, healer squad utilises the same format as well. Triggering is one of the many mechanics available to us, have you explored using dodge, counterattack and stealth to counter react to this strategy? Why not you put in USD $500 to make that team and show us how do you counter them?

Theorycrafting is cheap and amounts to mental masturbation, it lets us feel great about ourselves. But realising the theorycrafted team needs time and of course money, we’re playing a game published by a business not a non-profit organisation.

I await your team countering mine in the foreseeable weeks to come!

Your friendly neighbourhood wanker,

Speed.Wanker
Arathos

I called it cheap strategy because it's too reliable and consistent in what it does versus the game's general content and a good trigger team relieves the player of extensive strategy making. A fully built ranger trigger team is effective in almost all parts of the game. Even against raid 2, I think ranger squads can do a good chunk of damage even if there are counter auras from the bosses. I personally think it's kind of lame(there I changed it) that trigger teams are the easy route to this game and I think there are no other reliable ways so far to handle the game as efficiently. I'm personally pissed that this squad is so efficient and continues to get improved by the devs until this point(adding RRH for more skill damage but planning on nerfing the trigger squad consequently) while other classes and heroes, especially mystics are mostly bad except for PvP. 

Anyway, everything I was saying was personal insights. I'm not claiming I'm right but I think trigger squads are too efficient with what they do in the game. PvP, PvE, raid, ladder events lost map, they can do everything incredibly well as compared to other squad compositions. Without  a trigger team, I can't imagine getting far in the game, honestly. All in all, it's more of a personal frustration that why are some classes given impressive tools to utilize while other classes are almost useless?  

As I post this comment, i think nerfing trigger teams should only happen when more possible strategies can be utilized in handling the raid bosses. I think nerfing them is  well-deserved considering their general efficiency but what other strategy would work against the upcoming retconning of raid 2?

Yea bruv I respect your opinion, I hope you respect mine too. As a saying goes, we are all entitled to our opinions but seriously not many people would actually give a fuck about our opinions, and opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

The game is still on going and servers are still up because of paying players. The community is still alive because of semi p2p and f2p players generally as a whole. It takes two hands to clap, say I am a little bitch for paying for an entertainment I like, and you being the entitled snowflake who has an opinion and thinks everything should go your way. In a way we are on each both sides of the coin and fufills the hands that “claps” analogy. We keep this game alive, servers opened and we all can still login and enjoy the game as a whole collective.

There are actually ways to do raid 2, trigger team deals shit dmg to raid bosses tbh, i can safely say that because at maximum ability of ranger squad.. maxing out everything and min maxing to the best of my ability. Im only able to deal 8 to 10mil only, whereas someone who has twice the brain size as me and spends more time on the theorycrafting THEN spending resources and money to make the team showed me that it can be done. Half my cost but 3x my damage, there is no silver bullet for this. Only adapting to changes. I hope you’re not offended by my straightforward answers, just like you hope I’m not offended by yours. No worries, we all have an asshole to spew shit out of. We’re not any different from all the other 3000 players playing this game in each server.

If it cost alot to make, i doubt its a cheap easy strategy, the thinking going into how to further reducing my reliant on rng triggers is quite tedious. And in order to test that i just have to top up another 300 USD etc. to make it. And of course I’m a user of that strategy, basically compiled all experience archer squad users usage and came out with the best one, healer squad utilises the same format as well. Triggering is one of the many mechanics available to us, have you explored using dodge, counterattack and stealth to counter react to this strategy? Why not you put in USD $500 to make that team and show us how do you counter them?

Theorycrafting is cheap and amounts to mental masturbation, it lets us feel great about ourselves. But realising the theorycrafted team needs time and of course money, we’re playing a game published by a business not a non-profit organisation.

I await your team countering mine in the foreseeable weeks to come!

Your friendly neighbourhood wanker,

Speed.Wanker
Arathos

I called it cheap strategy because it's too reliable and consistent in what it does versus the game's general content and a good trigger team relieves the player of extensive strategy making. A fully built ranger trigger team is effective in almost all parts of the game. Even against raid 2, I think ranger squads can do a good chunk of damage even if there are counter auras from the bosses. I personally think it's kind of lame(there I changed it) that trigger teams are the easy route to this game and I think there are no other reliable ways so far to handle the game as efficiently. I'm personally pissed that this squad is so efficient and continues to get improved by the devs until this point(adding RRH for more skill damage but planning on nerfing the trigger squad consequently) while other classes and heroes, especially mystics are mostly bad except for PvP. 

Anyway, everything I was saying was personal insights. I'm not claiming I'm right but I think trigger squads are too efficient with what they do in the game. PvP, PvE, raid, ladder events lost map, they can do everything incredibly well as compared to other squad compositions. Without  a trigger team, I can't imagine getting far in the game, honestly. All in all, it's more of a personal frustration that why are some classes given impressive tools to utilize while other classes are almost useless?  

As I post this comment, i think nerfing trigger teams should only happen when more possible strategies can be utilized in handling the raid bosses. I think nerfing them is  well-deserved considering their general efficiency but what other strategy would work against the upcoming retconning of raid 2?

Yea bruv I respect your opinion, I hope you respect mine too. As a saying goes, we are all entitled to our opinions but seriously not many people would actually give a fuck about our opinions, and opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

The game is still on going and servers are still up because of paying players. The community is still alive because of semi p2p and f2p players generally as a whole. It takes two hands to clap, say I am a little bitch for paying for an entertainment I like, and you being the entitled snowflake who has an opinion and thinks everything should go your way. In a way we are on each both sides of the coin and fufills the hands that “claps” analogy. We keep this game alive, servers opened and we all can still login and enjoy the game as a whole collective.

There are actually ways to do raid 2, trigger team deals shit dmg to raid bosses tbh, i can safely say that because at maximum ability of ranger squad.. maxing out everything and min maxing to the best of my ability. Im only able to deal 8 to 10mil only, whereas someone who has twice the brain size as me and spends more time on the theorycrafting THEN spending resources and money to make the team showed me that it can be done. Half my cost but 3x my damage, there is no silver bullet for this. Only adapting to changes. I hope you’re not offended by my straightforward answers, just like you hope I’m not offended by yours. No worries, we all have an asshole to spew shit out of. We’re not any different from all the other 3000 players playing this game in each server.

Nah, I fully understand your opinion and not offended by it. This is a game so no hard feelings for the both of us. I'm just explaining what I see from my perspective. I simply think the nerf is well-deserved but you think it will be a nightmare for you. I totally understand that. 
On a different note, I doubt that there are more than 2000 players in this game. Most of my early game friends have quit long ago(I'm also in arathos btw) and while I see the possibility of 1000 players, I'd say a third of them are f2p. This game was well-thought out from a business point of view. Very player-friendly on early content (guide quests are generous honestly) but after that, you're left in a drought if you're persistent on not buying anything. I'm supposing this was intentional to hook you to the game and when you get to addicted(it's easy to get addicted to this game tbh), you may be forced to buy things or wither out.

The stratgy ain’t cheap, it cost 3k USD to make one fully functional team performing at max capability in order to compete. If they nerf it out of contention, alot of us have to quit.

Uhh, I meant cheap strategy, not cheap cost in forming the team. 

If it cost alot to make, i doubt its a cheap easy strategy, the thinking going into how to further reducing my reliant on rng triggers is quite tedious. And in order to test that i just have to top up another 300 USD etc. to make it. And of course I’m a user of that strategy, basically compiled all experience archer squad users usage and came out with the best one, healer squad utilises the same format as well. Triggering is one of the many mechanics available to us, have you explored using dodge, counterattack and stealth to counter react to this strategy? Why not you put in USD $500 to make that team and show us how do you counter them?

Theorycrafting is cheap and amounts to mental masturbation, it lets us feel great about ourselves. But realising the theorycrafted team needs time and of course money, we’re playing a game published by a business not a non-profit organisation.

I await your team countering mine in the foreseeable weeks to come!

Your friendly neighbourhood wanker,

Speed.Wanker
Arathos

Yo, Can i pressume you using a full trigger ranger? No offense, i not going to debate with you. But more of i kinda of suppprt the idea of going against the flow. I myself use ranger squad for very long and became sick of it. And yes, we spend alot of effort and money to craft them up. But the idea of using an alternative solution have been on my mind, healer sq, dodge team but recently i found my solution, zoey team.
1) healer squad is almost similar to ranger squad but the rng is way bigger than ranger, it is an effective killer sq but the chance level is risky. (and further more, i dont have eniugh healer)
2) dodge team, using sora and the current arthur with rune have prove to be quite useful until your dodge start to screw you up badly.
In order not to rely on rng too much, and to counter the ranger sq in arena while having some punch, i move into mystic team.
The long process of building 3 zoey took me many months, way before insigina, (which then i have high hope that 2 zoey is enough)
The intro of inisgina almost sink me and want to give up, but i stick on and build my zoey slowly, and yes the cost and blood use to build them up to mtp with full def gear is painful. But the result is very wellcoming.
Until the recent DS rune (I dont think DS can trigger in the past), makes the whole trigger thing fake, because 3 zoey crit down literally cripple ranger sq. And i dont believe that with 3 crit down, a ranger sq can still trigger for 30 sec non stop. Well i hoping someone can prove me wrong by not using DS. :p

Anyway, my point is, yes, there are alot of ways to do it, using zoey aura stunner, or atk down, skill delay in their aura have proven that there are ways to counter a,ranger squad. And with 12k def on each of the zoey and talent break, even if crit hit, you cannot kill them in 1 blow. Tested and proven.

So people out there should look around.. For solution, then waiting for people to feed or to blame the dev for the fault.

As for raid 2, they really did mention that they dont want sdd, so if someone can find a backdoor to it, they should close it. Or else its boring... Sdd force.

P.S i log in to reply you le.

On a different note, I doubt that there are more than 2000 players in this game. Most of my early game friends have quit long ago(I'm also in arathos btw) and while I see the possibility of 1000 players, I'd say a third of them are f2p.

Your "less than 2000 players" number is nonsense.

The top 1% cutoff last ladder (Red Riding Hood) on Everglades is rank 259, and on Arathos it is rank 267. That shows there are at least 26k players on each of these 2 servers, more since there will be players that didn't touch the event at all and wouldn't be counted in the ladder, as well as people who took a short break (for example, Christmas holiday).

The 1% cut off for Cassandra ladder (Snow white) was ranks 264 (Everglades) and 273 (Arathos).

Uhh, I meant cheap strategy, not cheap cost in forming the team. 

If it cost alot to make, i doubt its a cheap easy strategy, the thinking going into how to further reducing my reliant on rng triggers is quite tedious. And in order to test that i just have to top up another 300 USD etc. to make it. And of course I’m a user of that strategy, basically compiled all experience archer squad users usage and came out with the best one, healer squad utilises the same format as well. Triggering is one of the many mechanics available to us, have you explored using dodge, counterattack and stealth to counter react to this strategy? Why not you put in USD $500 to make that team and show us how do you counter them?

Theorycrafting is cheap and amounts to mental masturbation, it lets us feel great about ourselves. But realising the theorycrafted team needs time and of course money, we’re playing a game published by a business not a non-profit organisation.

I await your team countering mine in the foreseeable weeks to come!

Your friendly neighbourhood wanker,

Speed.Wanker
Arathos

Yo, Can i pressume you using a full trigger ranger? No offense, i not going to debate with you. But more of i kinda of suppprt the idea of going against the flow. I myself use ranger squad for very long and became sick of it. And yes, we spend alot of effort and money to craft them up. But the idea of using an alternative solution have been on my mind, healer sq, dodge team but recently i found my solution, zoey team.
1) healer squad is almost similar to ranger squad but the rng is way bigger than ranger, it is an effective killer sq but the chance level is risky. (and further more, i dont have eniugh healer)
2) dodge team, using sora and the current arthur with rune have prove to be quite useful until your dodge start to screw you up badly.
In order not to rely on rng too much, and to counter the ranger sq in arena while having some punch, i move into mystic team.
The long process of building 3 zoey took me many months, way before insigina, (which then i have high hope that 2 zoey is enough)
The intro of inisgina almost sink me and want to give up, but i stick on and build my zoey slowly, and yes the cost and blood use to build them up to mtp with full def gear is painful. But the result is very wellcoming.
Until the recent DS rune (I dont think DS can trigger in the past), makes the whole trigger thing fake, because 3 zoey crit down literally cripple ranger sq. And i dont believe that with 3 crit down, a ranger sq can still trigger for 30 sec non stop. Well i hoping someone can prove me wrong by not using DS. :p

Anyway, my point is, yes, there are alot of ways to do it, using zoey aura stunner, or atk down, skill delay in their aura have proven that there are ways to counter a,ranger squad. And with 12k def on each of the zoey and talent break, even if crit hit, you cannot kill them in 1 blow. Tested and proven.

So people out there should look around.. For solution, then waiting for people to feed or to blame the dev for the fault.

As for raid 2, they really did mention that they dont want sdd, so if someone can find a backdoor to it, they should close it. Or else its boring... Sdd force.

P.S i log in to reply you le.

Power to you for putting your effort and money where your mouth is, we could carry on the strategy discussion in Discord! You sir, are the kind of player I aspire to be like, have my respect!

On a different note, I doubt that there are more than 2000 players in this game. Most of my early game friends have quit long ago(I'm also in arathos btw) and while I see the possibility of 1000 players, I'd say a third of them are f2p.

Your "less than 2000 players" number is nonsense.

The top 1% cutoff last ladder (Red Riding Hood) on Everglades is rank 259, and on Arathos it is rank 267. That shows there are at least 26k players on each of these 2 servers, more since there will be players that didn't touch the event at all and wouldn't be counted in the ladder, as well as people who took a short break (for example, Christmas holiday).

The 1% cut off for Cassandra ladder (Snow white) was ranks 264 (Everglades) and 273 (Arathos).

Well, okay thanks for clarifying, then. I never really felt the presence of lower players as this game barely has social interactions. Maybe the game could add more social features like live PvP, hero/item trade, player market in the future?